Important issue with MMORPG

[Ivan Joi Dasecks]

I have always imagined a game would come out like this, a game with the touch of beautiful 3d graphics mixed with the potential of what UO could have been had it not for the corporate imperialistic practices of EA. I am a pretty solid vet of Ultima Online, I quit playing payed shards years ago. A LOT ruined that game, and since then every game that has come out has lacked a sandbox world, lacked true character freedom and path following.

With that said, one thing ruined Ultima Online, and plagues every other MMO. Currency. I know this might sound wierd, but I think the developers of this game should seriously look into it. If there were no currency, you wouldnt have farmers selling it, you wouldnt have rich people that own everything keeping great items from people that have nothing. Etc, etc. I am not suggested getting rid of currency completely.

So I have an idea, I think currency should be under items in the cycle of trading, meaning... have gold in the game, but make it a secondary trading medium. Example, monster drops a magic scroll and a set of armor, also 3 gold nuggets. Gold nuggets can be combined by a smelter into gold bars. Gold bars being the biggest you can make. NPC's will take gold as trade, but also items they are interested in. I.E., walk into a mage shop, offer swords and arrows, he would offer a paltry amount. Offer him magic items, he will pay more. Also, to remove the idea of gold 'stockpiling' on the server, so it just gets more, and more, and more, and more gold fed into as time goes by, you can make a lot of secondary uses for gold. Example, you smelt gold into jewlery, and cast magic on them... you smelt it to swords, and the swords can break. Smelt them to bowls for decorations to your home. I'm not suggesting all these things, just the idea of alternate uses for gold, to make it recycle, sap itself out of the system so players don't hord gold.

To be honest I don't think anyone knows what kind of currency they are thinking about, but I think this is a serious issue that needs to be brought up. Does anyone agree?

[F0rd]

I don't see a problem with currency, and as for gold sellers, why wouldn't they just sell equipment sets instead? or be a power-training service? Regardless of the radical methods you try to use to stop exploits and things that are "wrong" with a game, sometimes they're just wrong because people are wrong...

[Shawk]

Good idea,

They have said once or twice that the game won't have bears dropping gold or weapons, things like that. The thing with currency is it is somewhat a must in games, but honestly, if I live half way across the world why would my currency be the same as the other sides?

You do make a very good point that I have never actually thought of.

I dunno about the poll though, I personally think it should be up to the players to make a form of currency, Id rather have more tradding.. Swords for armor.

[Ravenwoods]

Currency shouldn't be the all ruling.

[Dani]

What's wrong with rich people in the game? I like working so hard I become filthy rich ...

EDIT : 100th post!!! Congrats to me!

[lawlerz]

I think mmorpgs just need to handle gold smarter than they have in the past.

1. NPCs should give a minimum amount of currency for items: this would encourage trading among PCs.

2. Have realistic limits on the amount of gold each NPC has: This would make trading unlimited farmed items to a single vendor impossible.

3. Have each NPC only accept a certain number of items from each PC: This would force gold farmers to travel to world looking for more vendors.

4. Have only certain vendors accept certain merchandise: simmilar to the OP's idea about getting less for selling the wrong items.

5. Have these restrictions become more severe if your IP is linked to gold farming: If you a gold farmer, be prepared to have each NPC accept one item from you only.

These could be expanded on, but they would go a long way in reducing the amount of excess gold on the servers.

[G.I. Joe]

Originally Posted by Dani

What's wrong with rich people in the game? I like working so hard I become filthy rich ...

EDIT : 100th post!!! Congrats to me!

stares into dani's deep soulfull avatar eyes!!!!!

[Dani]

Originally Posted by G.I. Joe

stares into dani's deep soulfull avatar eyes!!!!!

Watch it! I'm fast ... and I have pepper spray.

[G.I. Joe]

note to self =
wear my good running shoes
also get out gas mask and clean it

[G.I. Joe]

the economy is going to be run by the players which are going to determine how much things are bought and sold...........but...,..having NPC,s or general stores that set the price on basic armour, swords, mage stuff should all be stock piled and sold at a low price so the gamer can pk or do quests more easily because they can get back in the game faster having set low cost basic survival gear to buy! Now the rarer the item...which is based on a nuimber of things...ie: How hard it is to get materials for it..how long to make..how durable etc is whats gonna drive the pricing for such items.
Also if it is a quest item...well how hard and long the quest took along with how nice the drop is dictates that pricing too! Its gonna be a free market I hope...but some of the basic to medium quality basics should be available to everyone at a somewhat low cost with being able to grab them quickly so basic gameplay can resume....obviosly the poorest players are gonna need money too....so...we are all tied to it as nothing is free

[F0rd]

the economy is going to be run by the players which are going to determine how much things are bought and sold...........but...,..having NPC,s or general stores that set the price on basic armour, swords, mage stuff should all be stock piled and sold at a low price so the gamer can pk or do quests more easily because they can get back in the game faster having set low cost basic survival gear to buy! Now the rarer the item...which is based on a nuimber of things...ie: How hard it is to get materials for it..how long to make..how durable etc is whats gonna drive the pricing for such items.
Also if it is a quest item...well how hard and long the quest took along with how nice the drop is dictates that pricing too! Its gonna be a free market I hope...but some of the basic to medium quality basics should be available to everyone at a somewhat low cost with being able to grab them quickly so basic gameplay can resume....obviosly the poorest players are gonna need money too....so...we are all tied to it as nothing is free

I really feel that the only things that should be purchasable from NPCs are basic sack-cloth clothing and the most basic of any weapon. Other than that it should be looted from "sentient" NPCs or player made.

[Shawk]

Originally Posted by F0rd

I really feel that the only things that should be purchasable from NPCs are basic sack-cloth clothing and the most basic of any weapon. Other than that it should be looted from "sentient" NPCs or player made.

Ive always liked EQs idea of when you sell a NPC and item, that NPC then beggins trying to sell that item.

[F0rd]

An easy "fix" to that is to make it much more profitable to sell an item to players than the NPCs. That or you just can't buy/sell from NPCs. the reason EVE's economy needs so many more people online at once to work is because there's NO NPC interaction whatsoever. Players put out offers to buy items on the market, players put out items for sale on the market. They're regional auction houses, but the amount of people, items and money changing hands at once all makes it balance out very well.

Prices scale up quickly from the "newbie" items, say 6k "isk," to the mid-level weapons, for hundreds of thousands of "kredits", yet the items could cost as much as they do because they weren't unreasonable prices for players of that level. The need for undercutting in prices leads to a consumer-friendly market, while the regional aspect of the market means items can be outrageously expensive in underpopulated areas, yet insanely cheap in high-density areas, leading to an actual need for player merchants to move around items in the "world," making a pretty penny for themselves in the process.

[OMGPIE]

Usually the only problem with currency is farming *cough* WoW *cough* but that can be avoided I think, IF people don't get too lazy and just sit there and buy all the currency. Currency really isn't that hard to get if you do it right anyways.

[Ivan Joi Dasecks]

You don't get my point. None of you get the point.

After about 5 years of the server being online, you have a decent portion of all the gold that has ever been looted off of monsters, for FIVE years. That means every day the amount of gold on the server rises as the player base rises and an iflux in looting NPC enemies occurs. Players that obtain large portions of currency on said game sell or give away there share before quitting said game 9 out of 10 times. Considering gold NEVER goes away on most of these MMO games (because gold obtained from loot far exceeds gold obsorbed by NPC vendors), you have an unrealistic economy where prices don't react to the true inflation of said currency. I don't think currency SHOULD have to react to such nonsense, which is why I think the form of currency this game is going to use should be absorbed properly and fairly to help the long term economy.

I think a substance such as gold would be perfect, since in real life it's used as the base of many currencies. Gold can also be used in many, many ways. Here on earth, we don't have 'monsters' spawning gold. Governments and property owners own Gold mines, and it takes a national bank to control how much of that gold is used for currency. That way if someone goes up, its always because of someone going down. I don't like the idea of people going up because they spend 50 hours a week playing when I'm only physically able to play 10 or so. I think the economy should run like a real one with businesses and proper business ethic, that way even those of us that don't spend hours upon hours sitting at an auction house still have a chance to make a lot. So it isn't that I don't like the idea of rich people, it's that I don't like the idea of rich people making their entire MMO career hording money and selling it for real life cash. That seriously ruins games. People that played 50 hours trying to achieve a powerful weapon and fail to get it have to look at people buying accounts and enough gold to afford that weapon. That is ridiculous.

Does anyone understand now? I think I may have explained it better this time.

[Vizzledrix]

Originally Posted by Ivan Joi Dasecks

You don't get my point. None of you get the point.

After about 5 years of the server being online, you have a decent portion of all the gold that has ever been looted off of monsters, for FIVE years. That means every day the amount of gold on the server rises as the player base rises and an iflux in looting NPC enemies occurs. Players that obtain large portions of currency on said game sell or give away there share before quitting said game 9 out of 10 times. Considering gold NEVER goes away on most of these MMO games (because gold obtained from loot far exceeds gold obsorbed by NPC vendors), you have an unrealistic economy where prices don't react to the true inflation of said currency. I don't think currency SHOULD have to react to such nonsense, which is why I think the form of currency this game is going to use should be absorbed properly and fairly to help the long term economy.

I think a substance such as gold would be perfect, since in real life it's used as the base of many currencies. Gold can also be used in many, many ways. Here on earth, we don't have 'monsters' spawning gold. Governments and property owners own Gold mines, and it takes a national bank to control how much of that gold is used for currency. That way if someone goes up, its always because of someone going down. I don't like the idea of people going up because they spend 50 hours a week playing when I'm only physically able to play 10 or so. I think the economy should run like a real one with businesses and proper business ethic, that way even those of us that don't spend hours upon hours sitting at an auction house still have a chance to make a lot. So it isn't that I don't like the idea of rich people, it's that I don't like the idea of rich people making their entire MMO career hording money and selling it for real life cash. That seriously ruins games. People that played 50 hours trying to achieve a powerful weapon and fail to get it have to look at people buying accounts and enough gold to afford that weapon. That is ridiculous.

Does anyone understand now? I think I may have explained it better this time.

Crystal clear.......I have to agree the economy should run like like a maintained entity, there's nothing I hate more than having to spend half of my play time farming for crap to put on broker or an auction house just to upgrade my gear. Items that are vendored should be resold by said vendors so that players will have to rely on the NPC merchants and not totally on other players. With a floating currency, even the player exchange will be better regulated and the npc's become something more than a poorly implemented currency sink.

[Nox Vortem]

Ok, this is just an idea about trading I throw into the pile, but we all know that the economy IRL bases on Supply and Demand. How can we monitor that in game? My opinion is let players start up in Different Regions with Different Currency, Recourse, Clothing, Weapon and other stuff. The idea is to make everything different so that players are encouraged to trade to each other as group to group. By doing so, the game economy will regulate itself.

[Sorjak]

I think that, especially without universal banks and no easy teleporting methods, a sense of the supply and demand of any goods will be pretty readily apparent when the game matures a little. For example, it'll be common knowledge that some city in the northwest is the best place to go for wolf hides, or things like that.

[Shinzon]

Regional economies would probably be best, would allow for actual traders to haul caravans of goods from one city to another. With that also comes the bandits in the woods that try to steal that stuf...

[Vette]

The problem with MMORPG currencies are they are subject to inflation by design. You can increase the amount of gold in the world by increasing the amount of players collecting it because it comes from a limitless source. This eventually devalues it immensely over the life of the game. The only way to stop this is to make it a consumable resource either by making it an ingredient for crafting or by adding items produced by NPCs that are very important to the game. Shadowbane did this by making all buildings for cities purchasable from NPCs. They failed because they had a list of duping methods so long you could qipe your ass for days if you printed it.

[Uruz2012]

The main reason for all the inflation seems to be all the money that comes to the players through NPCs. You go out and spend a few hours raiding, farming, etc. and when you're done go to town and sell all the worthless junk to an NPC. Even if the mobs don't drop money there will still be a large amount of money entering the system through "trash" drops.

The solution would be to have very few things drop that can't be used for crafting. It never made sense for me to kill a giant spider and take it's guts then kill a bear and pull it's ears off then go to town and sell that crap to an NPC.

What the hell is that guy doing with all the junk he buys? And if that stuff is worth making into something then why can't I use it? Someone out there should be making spider gut soup and bear ear cloaks or something.

In summary only let us loot useful things from mobs. I never want to loot something that can be sold to an NPC for more than another player is willing to pay.

[Ivan Joi Dasecks]

Good ideas and input guys. I think we should keep this discussion going. Regional currency sounds pretty good. No loot from monstors you can sell to NPC's for major profit sounds good too.

We need more ideas.