if you don't get looted...

[disease]

This all depends if you played UO at launch, if you were pk'ed, all your items remained on your corpse, you appeared as a ghost next to your corpse and got the humbling view of watching the person who killed you rummaging through your corpse. The only way to rez was to run off in ghost form and find a wandering healer, or, run back to town and get rez’d by the healers there. Also in UO if you were killed by certain mobs they would loot your corpse of random items, you would need to kill the mob to get the items back.

I think that a lot of games now just really have no risk vs. reward, no sense of danger or cost in death. Back then you used to get death penalty of so many % knocked off of your skills when you died. You had to really think twice about what mob to tackle as there were no ‘Con’ indicators or level indicators, the only real way to find out if you could kill a mob or how tough it was, was to attack it and hope for the best, those were the days.
I am hoping that mortal online will take me back to those days of playing with a feeling of fear for my characters, and the sense of being part of an evolving game world.

[icon]

Originally Posted by disease

This all depends if you played UO at launch, if you were pk'ed, all your items remained on your corpse, you appeared as a ghost next to your corpse and got the humbling view of watching the person who killed you rummaging through your corpse. The only way to rez was to run off in ghost form and find a wandering healer, or, run back to town and get rez’d by the healers there. Also in UO if you were killed by certain mobs they would loot your corpse of random items, you would need to kill the mob to get the items back.

I think that a lot of games now just really have no risk vs. reward, no sense of danger or cost in death. Back then you used to get death penalty of so many % knocked off of your skills when you died. You had to really think twice about what mob to tackle as there were no ‘Con’ indicators or level indicators, the only real way to find out if you could kill a mob or how tough it was, was to attack it and hope for the best, those were the days.
I am hoping that mortal online will take me back to those days of playing with a feeling of fear for my characters, and the sense of being part of an evolving game world.

Disease I am also hoping for the same thing, and from what I've read it seems that MO will be a next gen UO which will be sweet!!!
I say when you die you res as a ghost and have to have a spirit healer, some artifact that can bring you back to life or a player that can see and res the dead.
Also when you dead you won't be able to communicate with the living. All your equipment, gold, except maybe a few game related things e.i spell book, house keys, maps, quest items stay in your bag everything else is lying on your corpse waiting for anyone to come by and pick it up.
When you do get ressed it's up to you to go back to your corpse with what you have left (you skills, and wit) to get your stuff back.
Of course there should also be decay, so say after you die you have 30 mins to before your corpse decays and with it all that was on it.

If you wanna play like you play on WOW and keep every single item on you thats your own risk. You should only have your armour and weapons that you need and items you need on you because even if you don't die there is nothing stopping a sneaky theive sneaking up while you distracted by some mob and stealing whats in your bag.

[Thalras Naeblis]

Originally Posted by icon

Disease I am also hoping for the same thing, and from what I've read it seems that MO will be a next gen UO which will be sweet!!!
I say when you die you res as a ghost and have to have a spirit healer, some artifact that can bring you back to life or a player that can see and res the dead.
Also when you dead you won't be able to communicate with the living. All your equipment, gold, except maybe a few game related things e.i spell book, house keys, maps, quest items stay in your bag everything else is lying on your corpse waiting for anyone to come by and pick it up.
When you do get ressed it's up to you to go back to your corpse with what you have left (you skills, and wit) to get your stuff back.
Of course there should also be decay, so say after you die you have 30 mins to before your corpse decays and with it all that was on it.

If you wanna play like you play on WOW and keep every single item on you thats your own risk. You should only have your armour and weapons that you need and items you need on you because even if you don't die there is nothing stopping a sneaky theive sneaking up while you distracted by some mob and stealing whats in your bag.

Yeah, this game is gonig to be sweet. But I heard that when you die you are still in danger in the ghost world, from other spirits maybe I don't know but I read that somewhere on a devs thread. All I know is you will want to get back to your body as quick as you can.

[stygiant]

Originally Posted by Sebastian Persson

But what happens if you die in the Etherworld? Any ides? If there's monsters I guess they can hit you but what should happen then?

If you 'die' in the Ether world, what would really happen is the priests barely managed to yank you out of there, and the result being a pretty nasty debuff - maybe like 70% HP cap and less dmg output/more dmg intake modifiers and such.

[Lyllyth]

I like the idea of an Ether World...

So, let's take one scenario;
You're out in the wilderness, collecting hides for crafting. During your excursion, you encounter a pack of wolves. The wolves encircle you, whichever gains your back, lunges and feints. In the end it becomes too much and the wolves over take and kill you.

You awaken in the Ether World and you know that the better you fare here, the better condition you'll be in once you reawaken in your physical body.
Running for dear life (or Soul in this case), you duck and dodge Ethereal flames and creatures. Knowing that each of these can result in a varying effect upon your awakened body, such as corporeal wounds, poisons, diseases, or even physically draining (str, agi, etc) effects. At the end of your final path, you see the altar that will awaken you, returning you to a corporeal form in the temple of your home city.

While you were running the Ethereal Gauntlet, your physical body remained. The wolves that killed you, took all of your rations. A passing Player rummaged through your items and took a few shiny items that you hadn't placed in storage yet. Another passing Player, having a Metalsmith friend, took your weapons to be melted down and recrafted. Though your body lay stripped of most of it's valuables, several "mundane" items remain.

Now awakened in the Temple, the Priests of the temple have supplied you with a simple robe. You return to your domicile to gather a few necessities for the journey to your corpse. Of all the items you know that have probably been taken, there is one you hope remains. Grabbing a simple set of leather armor, a sword, shield, bow and a few rations, you set out to reclaim your lost possessions. You locate the place where you died, and there lay the remains of what was once you. Rummaging through, you notice that your rations, gems, jewels and weapons had been taken. But the hides remain! Simple, untreated hides do not sell for much, but oh the things you can do with them.

[admiralnlson]

Originally Posted by Lyllyth

awesomeness

Don't know if this was loosely inspired by something I said earlier in this thread (the clothes provided my clerics part ), but I totally agree with this scenario.

[OMGPIE]

Originally Posted by Lyllyth

I like the idea of an Ether World...

So, let's take one scenario;
You're out in the wilderness, collecting hides for crafting. During your excursion, you encounter a pack of wolves. The wolves encircle you, whichever gains your back, lunges and feints. In the end it becomes too much and the wolves over take and kill you.

You awaken in the Ether World and you know that the better you fare here, the better condition you'll be in once you reawaken in your physical body.
Running for dear life (or Soul in this case), you duck and dodge Ethereal flames and creatures. Knowing that each of these can result in a varying effect upon your awakened body, such as corporeal wounds, poisons, diseases, or even physically draining (str, agi, etc) effects. At the end of your final path, you see the altar that will awaken you, returning you to a corporeal form in the temple of your home city.

While you were running the Ethereal Gauntlet, your physical body remained. The wolves that killed you, took all of your rations. A passing Player rummaged through your items and took a few shiny items that you hadn't placed in storage yet. Another passing Player, having a Metalsmith friend, took your weapons to be melted down and recrafted. Though your body lay stripped of most of it's valuables, several "mundane" items remain.

Now awakened in the Temple, the Priests of the temple have supplied you with a simple robe. You return to your domicile to gather a few necessities for the journey to your corpse. Of all the items you know that have probably been taken, there is one you hope remains. Grabbing a simple set of leather armor, a sword, shield, bow and a few rations, you set out to reclaim your lost possessions. You locate the place where you died, and there lay the remains of what was once you. Rummaging through, you notice that your rations, gems, jewels and weapons had been taken. But the hides remain! Simple, untreated hides do not sell for much, but oh the things you can do with them.

Interesting scenario I would like to see something like that MO I think it would be great if your trip from the Ether World would affect your regular world body such as diseases and skill draining and the other you mentioned I think it would add a lot of importance to actually getting back to your normal self and I think it would add a big layer of fun to the mix.

[Zerwas]

corpse run complete naked as a developer

[Sigbert]

Hej,

I dont know if its realy a good scenario wenn you can lost all your stuff.

I mean lets take a PvP battle for example. When one side is stronger then the other they will kill ther opposides like flys (yeah thats obviously). But what will happen then, the killed players will resurected without there stuff, may not even near by the battlefield. So there own weak side has now lost a fighter, gained a fighter who has lost all its stuff and is running around almost naked? He would never ever had a chance to get its Items back, excepte there where so much worthless that not even a crow would take them. Cause the overweighted horde will just overran the other horde. So that means that the battle is decided within a few minutes, when not even befor it starts.

And with that knowledge would you realy take your rare items to a battle? Would it make any sense to go to a battle with something with worth on your futur corps? I mean when you toke about 3 days playtime to get the materials for a rare craftable sword and then two more days to find a smith to crafting it, would you take it with you to a battle in the knowledge that you can lose it within a few minutes, without a chance to see it again? I think thats frustrating.

And my last point. When a priest or healer or what ever will resurect you, will bring your dead body from the fatal ground back to the temple. So why shoud he only bring your dead body and not all stuff still sticked to your dead body too?

Whats about a comrpomise, e.g. the player killer can loot a amount of gold and can get a badge from the dead corpse. And with enougth badges he can get a real reward or something. Or he can loot the stuff the killed player has in its pockets but not his gear.

greetings

[Unomat]

If every PvP battle would be a mindless zerg into an open field, I think you'd be right Sigbert. As a consequence I think a modicum of tactics and strategy, taking account of terrain advantages for example, will enter the game within the very first month after launch. The archetypical Explorer will be vindicated, as it'd be his job to find those locations in the first place.

To add to that I think the Socializers who like to collect relatively worthless items and hand them out to recently resurrected characters (as a kind of gear exchange) will get a lot more respect. Other than that, players themselves could set up a contingency plan in case they die and stash yesterday's clothes away for safekeeping.

As far as the resurrecters go: they build your body from the ground up (including all missing body parts), based on your spirit. No teleporting gear please.

My vote: items stay on a fallen character. The longer the body remains there the more will have been looted up to the point where all usable items are gone. Dead is dead. You can't have your cake and eat it.

[Sigbert]

What my previouse post didn't say was, yes I also want the items to stay with the corps.

Be hornest Unomat, useless items will help some resurrected player how far in a big battle? I mean it's okay when you get any penalty for dying, but losing the epic armor or even a part of it? That sounds neither fair nor funny for me.

And its realy hard to coordinate 50 or 100 players in a battle, it'll be a mindless zerg open field battle. I would like to join such a battle even if I see no chance for my team, but I want join it with my best gear and I mustn't have to fear that I could lose any of it.

greetings

[Unomat]

Without fear of losing, there's no pride to be gained in winning, and I for one have better ways to spend my time online than waste it for the sake of an adrenaline rush I could also get in a rollercoaster run in an IRL Theme Park. Big bonus of the latter would be my 6-year old son sitting next to me ^^

Sigbert, if your gear needs to win your battles for you, then what sense of accomplishment does the actual win deliver? It should be player skill making the difference, and with the proverbial skill I mean the whole gamut of knowing when to run, when to hide, when to strike and when to beg for mercy in order to max your chance of succes or limiting your losses.

And of course you cannot coordinate 50-100 players at the same time. The maximum span of control according to management literature is about 30 persons, so any army that has squads challenging that boundary will rapidly see its chances dwindling. If your army is not able to function in squads comprised of different roles (note: NOT classes!) but zerg instead, you're bound to run into the spike-filled ditch the other army dug for you.

Imho it would be a fitting punishment to loot riches from people who flaunt them but so obviously not deserve them, once they so willingly ran into the graves that have been dug by their opponents under a scorching sun ^^

[Talaysen]

I would say leave the items on the body with a decay timer. Some critters and NPCs should be able to loot a totally random item or two including items which may be locked/bound (assuming there will be such a sink). The higher the level the more likely they would loot.

PCs should be able to loot bodies with exception of locked/bound items. Assuming fatigue after combat, weight of said items on the corpse should be doubled (at least) until decay for PCs.

Again, this is assuming there will be some type of sink to lock/bind items. If there is it should be expensive to maintain and limited in the amount (say no more that 2 or 3 items).

If there isn't a sink, just making the items weight more for a PC looting would make you have to pick and choose as you likely would not be able to carry all of it (prolly wouldn't want all of it anyway).

[Sigbert]

You can proude for a win even without losing all your stuff or fearing even this. What sense would crafting have when it makes no difference between using good or bad items? I mean, imagine 50 player almost nacked shouting out, Hej we use our skills.

And the winner still get the proud of winning a great battle. Even the losers still had fun joining a huge battle.

I mean what sense did any gear made when its not worth to not losing it. And regardless which army wins, one will lose, and so they will lost there items.

[Unomat]

If all fights are to the death and noone is smart enough to retreat in order to regroup or make a run for it, then SOME losers would lose SOME items as not everything can and will be dragged off the battlefield. However to the winners, trying to slaughter all opponents comes at a price: losing a lot of comrades and THEY would run the risk of losing gear as well.

No commander in his right mind would test the willingness of his troops to lose more than they could possibly gain, nor will any commander in his right mind support a bloodthirsty minority that continues to fight after the sign 'battle is over' has been called, as it would weaken army morale (read: willingness of other players to participate on the same side of a future battle).

So, if you expect your opponents to be total savages, you might lose a piece or two of armor. If they're REALLY confident, they bring a large number of carriages to pick all bodies clean. Then again if their confidence is bolstered by the way they outnumber you, why do you even run into them at all?

The smart move would be to:
1) lure them over to that patch of quicksand and drown at least a couple to even the odds,
2) then send in your best tanking squad to hold the opponent's infantry in place,
3) get some light troops to flank their bowmen under the cover of trees and
4) let your squad of mages perform a combined ritual to summon a large scale thunderstorm that zaps those enemy knights in their nice and shiny armors over there, meanwhile not hindering the leather dudes in their midst at all.

Now, if you were to win a battle against all odds like I just described, wouldn't you want to have a trophy at least? Because you already won your war with the gear you have, so why trade it for something obviously inferior from a dead person?

And even if your opponent HAD superior gear how would you be able to tell (unless the game spoonfed that information to you)? Are you going to walk around with a big pile of loot strapped on your back 'just in case' or 'as a way to make a living', making yourself a prime target for any player who likes to make his mark in the world in the process?

[SukaD]

Originally Posted by Sigbert

I mean what sense did any gear made when its not worth to not losing it. And regardless which army wins, one will lose, and so they will lost there items.

A loss doesn't always mean death for the losing party, if death is something to fear then people will want to avoid it if there is no potential gain. If you've broken the back of an opposing force you should be able to expect them to flee.

When death carries serious penalties the game is much more realistic and tactics are more relevant to real life situations.
If you're outnumbered and outmatched would it make sense to lead yourself to the slaughter?

Sun Tzu can say it much better than I can.

The victorious strategist only seeks battle after the victory has been won, whereas he who is destined to defeat first fights and afterwards looks for victory. -Sun Tzu

If there is no chance of victory then do not bother fighting, if it costs you more to engage than you gain then it is better to elude the enemy and face him when you are strong and he is weak.

[iannetti67]

Originally Posted by Traceur

if you die and don't get looted, should you still resurrect with all your stuff or should you have to go and take them from your last place of death?

Since I'm in favor of full loot, then I believe a person should not resurrect with all his equipment. All the gear should remain on the corpse and be up for grabs. While you may lose beloved gear quickly, you can find new gear you love even more just as quickly off the corpses of other players.

Dead players should revive with nothing but a simple robe or shirt and pants. In another thread, I brought up an idea to help newly revived players obtain some crappy gear in case they ran out of money or do not have any back up pieces:

http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/2...ying-army.html

[hotix]

I think people should lose 1 item, thats totally manageable to lose. If you lose just 1 piece of gear all the wow babys could deal with it and would still play. This is probably the best we will get with having to make it playable for everyone.

[Kreeper]

Originally Posted by hotix

I think people should lose 1 item, thats totally manageable to lose. If you lose just 1 piece of gear all the wow babys could deal with it and would still play. This is probably the best we will get with having to make it playable for everyone.

Yeah I would have to agree.

[Lachrymose]

i gotta disagree there. i don't think we should have to accommodate for the players that don't want full loot, since there are plenty of games out there that they can play without having to worry about being looted.

if you die, you should have to make a corpse run to get it back. keep in mind, the gear in MO isn't going to be so uber that if you lose it, it's going to be a huge setback. most gear should be relatively easy to replace.

if you do have something you don't want to lose, keep it safe. that's the downside to using a more powerful item, you run the risk of losing it.

[1reaver1]

Originally Posted by Sebastian Persson

But what happens if you die in the Etherworld? Any ides? If there's monsters I guess they can hit you but what should happen then?

What if you had the option of etherworld or rez by priests? You could have different consequenses based on your choice.

Rez by priest, you are naked and have to track down your body, but it is quicker.

Go to etherworld, yeah you have to fight you way out, but once the original killer closes loot, the remainer of your stuff is returned to you. Now prepare to fight your way out and be thankful if your looters backpacks were full.


Die in the either world and and you are reset to the begining or once again you can priest rez with nothing. (that was the original risk anyway. You were just rolling the dice on having anything left.) People could die and come help you in the etherworld, but no PVP, you have enough problems...lol.

You could also have some nice drops in the etherworld. You are after all in a rather unique place. Additionally it would make the payoff worth wild for dropping into a potential time sink and give people al anlternate place to goof off if they wanted to take a chance and go somewhere for a while with no PVP.

(Getting tired of PVP, die and go play in the etherworld. Once you return after days of exploring you might be a little tougher and ready to take on the masses again.)

[Lyllyth]

Wow, this is going all kinds of wrong directions...

Single-Item loot? Maybe if you only had 1 item worth taking.
No, this is a PvP game, to my understanding. Limit looting and it would be detrimental to game play and "thrill factor". I'm more of a PvE person and even I acknowledge this fact.

Resurrection? If that's a function in the game.
I gave my thoughts on the Ether World, where, after maneuvering your way through the Ether World, you would appear at your main city's temple, with no gear. Why no gear? Because the gear that was not looted by your killer or a passerby, will remain on your corpse until you collect it.
However, if another Player resurrects you, I imagine this should function like resurrection in any other game, you appear near either your corpse or the person who resurrected you and would have to loot your own corpse. None of this popping up with gear stuff.
Corpse runs EQ style.

Somewhere else it was mentioned about "Soul Bound" items, which I suggested would mean that one would retain a "ghost image" or "copy" of said item while transgressing the Ether World, the item would disappear once you are either resurrected or completed your trek through the Ether World.

[1reaver1]

Originally Posted by Lyllyth

Wow, this is going all kinds of wrong directions...

Single-Item loot? Maybe if you only had 1 item worth taking.
No, this is a PvP game, to my understanding. Limit looting and it would be detrimental to game play and "thrill factor". I'm more of a PvE person and even I acknowledge this fact.

Resurrection? If that's a function in the game.
I gave my thoughts on the Ether World, where, after maneuvering your way through the Ether World, you would appear at your main city's temple, with no gear. Why no gear? Because the gear that was not looted by your killer or a passerby, will remain on your corpse until you collect it.
However, if another Player resurrects you, I imagine this should function like resurrection in any other game, you appear near either your corpse or the person who resurrected you and would have to loot your own corpse. None of this popping up with gear stuff.
Corpse runs EQ style.

Somewhere else it was mentioned about "Soul Bound" items, which I suggested would mean that one would retain a "ghost image" or "copy" of said item while transgressing the Ether World, the item would disappear once you are either resurrected or completed your trek through the Ether World.

hehe, yeah i don't think looting 1 item is going to be implemented. I wouldn't sweat that. You might see thinks like only the killer can loot or loot for a period before your body goes public for loot, but i don't think you would see a singe item loot occur.

If so, i doubt i would be wasting much time pvp'ing, of course like you i am more of a PVE'er. I just go PvP'ing when i have to flex my authorita.

[Lyllyth]

Originally Posted by 1reaver1

hehe, yeah i don't think looting 1 item is going to be implemented. I wouldn't sweat that. You might see thinks like only the killer can loot or loot for a period before your body goes public for loot, but i don't think you would see a singe item loot occur.

If so, i doubt i would be wasting much time pvp'ing, of course like you i am more of a PVE'er. I just go PvP'ing when i have to flex my authorita.

Loot Locking wouldn't bother me a bit... save us from the "wormtail"-types out there. Snatch-n-run.

I normally only PvP when it's warranted; Defense, raid, or a challenge. There are times when I'm in a PvP mood and will be the one making the challenge, but I'm not the type to gank or jump someone, I want them to be aware of me. An honor fight, if you will.