Please make everyone be fully lootable when dead! - Page 3

Rossm · 14th August 2008, 00:32

I've been in uber guilds before but currently I am not in any uber guild because I don't like being on every night from X to X time. That said, I think that FFA looting is more friendly to those of us NOT in those uber guilds. That is because only those people in hardcore guilds can go out and raid the really intense PvE aspects of the game whereas the casual players can't. However, a good casual player can kill a player in a great guild, and thus get his great crafted armor that without FFA looting, he wouldn't have access to.

Voltmeer · 14th August 2008, 01:56

Assuming that items or crafted oriented PvE raiding is just one of many ways to gain money for players. Players in large guilds are going to generally be with other members and out number you and out class you. And, if you do pull off some upset it's probably going to be short lived as you get marked by 500 players.

The idea that looting levels the playing ground is at best naive and worst disingenuous. Full looting empowers mobs not indivduals. Plus it frustrates people in general a bad day, a little bordom and getting ganked and losing all their stuff is usually enough of a combination for people to get pissed and uninstall. That's not necessarily a bad thing, but it does squeeze out casual players. The upside of that is it creates strong ties with guilds and that generally makes a very loyal fan base. Open PVP creates gang environment mentality as it is, yu add full looting and it reinforces that further. That's hardly attractive to the vast mjority of casul players.

Arxon Havenloft · 14th August 2008, 03:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Voltmeer

I don't buy that. I don't have anything against full loot (if the PVP system as some form of control so the game isn't just one big gank feast and that has more to do with "open" PVP then looting), but the people who support full loot do so because they have a strong online network. Because of that the loss of gear is less important to them and a lot less likely to happen. I'm not saying there is anything wrong with that, but lets be truthful about it and acknowledge the frustration that casual gamers would have who aren't part of the ubber guilds that have strong ties outside of any particular game.

I'm not part of an uber guild and to be honest I would like nothing to do with them. Though I am still very much for full loot FFA PvP. I enjoy it for many reasons. As a crafter it means everything in terms of return customers or keeping me in business. I can sell 30 sets of armor in a day to players that are always in need of it, or I could sit around spamming trade chat for a week trying to sell some "epic gear of the what everyone else is wearing". I prefer more customers and more player interaction and full loot creates that. That's from a crafter's point of view anyways.

It's also a great way to keep your own gear stocked by looting it from other players, and it adds fear of death to players which makes the game feel more realistic. FFA I just enjoy because some people are just really annoying and it delights me to kill them.

And yes, items will be much less meaningful and casual players will be able to jump right on in with the vets much more easily because of this. I guess you'd have to play it to fully understand.

Unomat · 14th August 2008, 07:25

Voltmeer, if all information you can get is the name of the player when you do a mouse-over (no floating names nor guild tags), how is anyone going to know whether he's run into a casual player or a member of the 500 man guild?

The protection of the casual is the fact no one will be able to know he is one at a glance. And furthermore, why should a game cater to people who don't want to invest anything into it in terms of socializing (guilds are not the be all end all of social networks), teaming up or honing their skills? There are enough of those already

Arxon Havenloft · 14th August 2008, 21:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unomat

Voltmeer, if all information you can get is the name of the player when you do a mouse-over (no floating names nor guild tags),

[Thread Hijack]

Is this true? I understand not seeing anything until mouse-over, but we wont see guild names? What's the point of being in a guild if you cannot show it off or advertise for it with the guild title? Besides, when I sell my wares to people I have a blacklist so to speak. People that I will not sell to due to whatever reasons. Sometimes I'll blacklist an entire guild. It'd be nice to know what that guild was...

[/Thread Hijack]

melanko · 15th August 2008, 01:48

One thing people need to remember that killing random people will mark you as a murderer or a bandit. That will make it more difficult to be in NPC cities and maybe even player cities where you might be attacked by guards. So if you want to run around ganking, people will start remembering your name and maybe one person will get so angry by it, they might make it their life goal to hunt you down or maybe put a bounty on your head for other players. Then you, the dasterdly bandit, gets killed, you lose all your stuff, and you try to go back to town where you are not very warmly greeted.

From that I'd love to see groups of 'PKers' coming together under one banner, basically making a group of bandits in some random part of the world.

Valor-LotD · 15th August 2008, 02:02

Even though this topic has been covered already, I think that the three pages of discussion here is an exemplary way of identifying that it is still an important and controversial issue.

Full Loot is likely to be implemented, but HOW.

I think that one of the better parts of a full loot system is that it decreases the importance of UBER LEET GEAR, because you are likely going to lose it eventually. So it completely shifts the focus off of getting the best sword and armor, to being completely badass with the resources available to you.

So, I agree, full loot, and the more limitations added, the more importance the design team is putting on gear in this game.

Shinzon · 15th August 2008, 02:31

Quote:

Is this true? I understand not seeing anything until mouse-over, but we wont see guild names? What's the point of being in a guild if you cannot show it off or advertise for it with the guild title? Besides, when I sell my wares to people I have a blacklist so to speak. People that I will not sell to due to whatever reasons. Sometimes I'll blacklist an entire guild. It'd be nice to know what that guild was...

Then do it like they did in medival times; wear a tabard, with the guild/craftsman/kingdom crest on it. No need for any floating name.

As for killing people; if a guard doesn't see it, why should anyone else? A quiet dagger in the dark...

Arxon Havenloft · 15th August 2008, 12:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shinzon

Then do it like they did in medival times; wear a tabard, with the guild/craftsman/kingdom crest on it. No need for any floating name.

Except you cannot read a guild tabard. I cannot just blacklist everyone with a black and white tabard. Maybe it'll be on a character sheet/profile if we can inspect them? I mean, you have to be able to find out what guild someone is in..

Zwackelzahn · 15th August 2008, 13:24

I kinda like the guild tabbard only idea, if guilds have exclusive logos/colors than you would recognize them!

My second day in UO I got PKt by like 15 guys all waering yellow, they called themself the Banana Boys.
I didnt need to see a guildname to recognize them from that day on ;D

But it also plays into the idea of having a KOS list... meaning that if you ever got PKt or harrased by someone, even if you meet the guy a year later, with an ingame KOS list you would immediately recognize that you have an "open bill" with that fella... Do we want a KOS list? It makes things easy... but does it take away immersion ? not sure... I will still write names down if there isnt a KOS list ingame... a List like that would solve your problem though, as you just put a whole guild on the list... and their name would show up in a diffrent color or something so you know they are KOS to you...

Arxon Havenloft · 16th August 2008, 06:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zwackelzahn

I kinda like the guild tabbard only idea, if guilds have exclusive logos/colors than you would recognize them!

My second day in UO I got PKt by like 15 guys all waering yellow, they called themself the Banana Boys.
I didnt need to see a guildname to recognize them from that day on ;D

But it also plays into the idea of having a KOS list... meaning that if you ever got PKt or harrased by someone, even if you meet the guy a year later, with an ingame KOS list you would immediately recognize that you have an "open bill" with that fella... Do we want a KOS list? It makes things easy... but does it take away immersion ? not sure... I will still write names down if there isnt a KOS list ingame... a List like that would solve your problem though, as you just put a whole guild on the list... and their name would show up in a diffrent color or something so you know they are KOS to you...

Oh I don't know, I wasn't expecting a KOS list to be implemented. I use the old fashioned paper and pencil, heh. But there is nothing stopping a guy from just wearing a robe over his tabard, or wearing a different color tabard alltogether just to pass blame and maybe frame a different guild. And who knows how many different guilds would have similar colors, etc.. I would just prefer a 3 letter guild abbr. in the tooltip when you hover over them. Why not? You get their name, guild, and I guess maybe a rank within the guild. It's not like it hurts anything.

Anyways, let's get back on topic.

Zwackelzahn · 16th August 2008, 13:54

yeah I dont see it taking away anything eithe.

Back to topic than, lets close this as we all agree on full loot!

Lachrymose · 16th August 2008, 15:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zwackelzahn

yeah I dont see it taking away anything eithe.

Back to topic than, lets close this as we all agree on full loot!

please don't speak for everyone. i think full loot is an awful idea along with ffa pvp and skill based combat. give me safe zones, auto targetting, and a massive grind to an arbitrary level cap!

Arxon Havenloft · 16th August 2008, 19:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lachrymose

please don't speak for everyone. i think full loot is an awful idea along with ffa pvp and skill based combat. give me safe zones, auto targetting, and a massive grind to an arbitrary level cap!

I am actually pleasantly surprised that we don't actually see many of these posts around here. As far as forum communities are concerned, I don't think that I have ever been a part of a better, more mature community. Even if someone had such a view as the one you mentioned, they would likely make up a nicely formatted post with a lot of reasoning within it.

The lack of one-liner posts really excites me.

Shinzon · 16th August 2008, 19:28

Quote:

please don't speak for everyone. i think full loot is an awful idea along with ffa pvp and skill based combat. give me safe zones, auto targetting, and a massive grind to an arbitrary level cap!

I think he was joking, and being sarcastic...

Lachrymose · 16th August 2008, 19:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shinzon

I think he was joking, and being sarcastic...

absolutely NOT. there isn't even a trace of sarcasm in my post!

oh, and i agree with arxon. quit junkin up the forums with your one-liner posts, shinzon!

Arxon Havenloft · 16th August 2008, 20:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lachrymose

absolutely NOT. there isn't even a trace of sarcasm in my post!

oh, and i agree with arxon. quit junkin up the forums with your one-liner posts, shinzon!

Oh, he's just trying to catch me in post count, hehe

My month and a half vacation helped him a lot!

I'm just kidding, Shinzon, I know that you could care less about post counts.

hotix · 18th August 2008, 03:30

Please make items lootable, if not all items atleast one like old school eq. That I think was the best way to do things, losing 1 item is acceptable especially if things are hard to get, but losing nothing is very lame. That allows people to rez zerg you, and other various noob options.

Abydos · 18th August 2008, 14:36

Whit good system economic, full loot is realy realy great !

Kreeper · 18th August 2008, 19:25

It doesent make sense to have complete lootable bodies because as long as your online and you can get disconnected or something stupid can happen you'll die and than lose all your shit....

Until they have some way to resolve any issue like that I just can't see it benefitting to have that in the game. I mean it all happens to us sometime or another where you just crash, I don't want to lose all my gear because of it.

Arxon Havenloft · 20th August 2008, 03:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kreeper

It doesent make sense to have complete lootable bodies because as long as your online and you can get disconnected or something stupid can happen you'll die and than lose all your shit....

Until they have some way to resolve any issue like that I just can't see it benefitting to have that in the game. I mean it all happens to us sometime or another where you just crash, I don't want to lose all my gear because of it.

I don't know about you, but when I crash I normally attempt to get right back on. If I happen to have died within that couple of minutes then I would either go back to my corpse and get my things, or kill whatever mob/player looted them. Either that or just call it a loss and go grab some new stuff real quick.

Peasant · 24th August 2008, 22:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kreeper

It doesent make sense to have complete lootable bodies because as long as your online and you can get disconnected or something stupid can happen you'll die and than lose all your shit....

Until they have some way to resolve any issue like that I just can't see it benefitting to have that in the game. I mean it all happens to us sometime or another where you just crash, I don't want to lose all my gear because of it.

Well they can make it so the game is not gear-oriented, but it's your skills that make you a good fighter, not your uber-sword.

Plus no-one, in the history of gaming, ever had only one weapon with him, or only one set of armor. Everyone keeps several in safe-boxes and/or houses.

And it would beat the farmers too, as they would rather gravitate towards gear-oriented games like WoW.

Full l00t is a win-win situation

Isil · 25th August 2008, 01:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kreeper

It doesent make sense to have complete lootable bodies because as long as your online and you can get disconnected or something stupid can happen you'll die and than lose all your shit....

Until they have some way to resolve any issue like that I just can't see it benefitting to have that in the game. I mean it all happens to us sometime or another where you just crash, I don't want to lose all my gear because of it.

And what if you lose everything ? just craft more or loot from enemy or buy from a crafter , .... if there is full loot system im sure that those crafted items will be easy to get...anyone played UO ? we were all day long pvping and lossing items one after another ..np !

Full loot, mean there will be active economy, fair pvp with all people pvping with similar items , chance for casual players not forced to pvp VS players with "Epic" weapons , immersive world .. where if u die , you lost something .

I remember playing UO the first week and going with some friend into a dungeon ( it was deceit i think ) .. and running out after some mins followed by 3 "red players" ( Players killers ) ..my heart was about to explode because i could lose everything i had..that was FUN...10 year ago..and still waiting for something like UO.

Give us full loot pls !

Shinzon · 25th August 2008, 02:35

Quote:

I remember playing UO the first week and going with some friend into a dungeon ( it was deceit i think ) .. and running out after some mins followed by 3 "red players" ( Players killers ) ..my heart was about to explode because i could lose everything i had..that was FUN...10 year ago..and still waiting for something like UO.

That is the exact reason to have full loot and FFA PvP everywhere. Even though the experiences might seem "Bad" at the moment, those same experiences are the ones you will look back to starry eyed and say "Back in the day, I had so much fun with that game".

14th August 2008, 07:25	#84 (permalink)
Unomat Junior Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Delft, The Netherlands Age: 38 Posts: 241 Rep Power: 1	Voltmeer, if all information you can get is the name of the player when you do a mouse-over (no floating names nor guild tags), how is anyone going to know whether he's run into a casual player or a member of the 500 man guild? The protection of the casual is the fact no one will be able to know he is one at a glance. And furthermore, why should a game cater to people who don't want to invest anything into it in terms of socializing (guilds are not the be all end all of social networks), teaming up or honing their skills? There are enough of those already __________________ Common sense is not so common. -Voltaire Human beings, who are almost unique in having the ability to learn from the experience of others, are also remarkable for their apparent disinclination to do so. - Douglas Adams

15th August 2008, 01:48	#86 (permalink)
melanko Junior Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 82 Rep Power: 1	One thing people need to remember that killing random people will mark you as a murderer or a bandit. That will make it more difficult to be in NPC cities and maybe even player cities where you might be attacked by guards. So if you want to run around ganking, people will start remembering your name and maybe one person will get so angry by it, they might make it their life goal to hunt you down or maybe put a bounty on your head for other players. Then you, the dasterdly bandit, gets killed, you lose all your stuff, and you try to go back to town where you are not very warmly greeted. From that I'd love to see groups of 'PKers' coming together under one banner, basically making a group of bandits in some random part of the world. __________________ Melanko's Gamer Blog. "See you down in Arizona Bay... " -B. Hicks/MJK

15th August 2008, 02:02	#87 (permalink)
Valor-LotD Newbie Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: D.C. Posts: 8 Rep Power: 0	Even though this topic has been covered already, I think that the three pages of discussion here is an exemplary way of identifying that it is still an important and controversial issue. Full Loot is likely to be implemented, but HOW. I think that one of the better parts of a full loot system is that it decreases the importance of UBER LEET GEAR, because you are likely going to lose it eventually. So it completely shifts the focus off of getting the best sword and armor, to being completely badass with the resources available to you. So, I agree, full loot, and the more limitations added, the more importance the design team is putting on gear in this game. __________________ Lords of the Dead - 13 years of Online PvP Excellence

15th August 2008, 13:24	#90 (permalink)
Zwackelzahn Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 54 Rep Power: 1	I kinda like the guild tabbard only idea, if guilds have exclusive logos/colors than you would recognize them! My second day in UO I got PKt by like 15 guys all waering yellow, they called themself the Banana Boys. I didnt need to see a guildname to recognize them from that day on ;D But it also plays into the idea of having a KOS list... meaning that if you ever got PKt or harrased by someone, even if you meet the guy a year later, with an ingame KOS list you would immediately recognize that you have an "open bill" with that fella... Do we want a KOS list? It makes things easy... but does it take away immersion ? not sure... I will still write names down if there isnt a KOS list ingame... a List like that would solve your problem though, as you just put a whole guild on the list... and their name would show up in a diffrent color or something so you know they are KOS to you... __________________ KASE Breakdown: Achiever 66.67%, Explorer 13.33%, Killer 93.33%, Socializer 26.67%

16th August 2008, 13:54	#92 (permalink)
Zwackelzahn Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 54 Rep Power: 1	yeah I dont see it taking away anything eithe. Back to topic than, lets close this as we all agree on full loot! __________________ KASE Breakdown: Achiever 66.67%, Explorer 13.33%, Killer 93.33%, Socializer 26.67%

14th August 2008, 00:32	#81 (permalink)
Rossm Newbie Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Louisiana Age: 20 Posts: 4 Rep Power: 0	I've been in uber guilds before but currently I am not in any uber guild because I don't like being on every night from X to X time. That said, I think that FFA looting is more friendly to those of us NOT in those uber guilds. That is because only those people in hardcore guilds can go out and raid the really intense PvE aspects of the game whereas the casual players can't. However, a good casual player can kill a player in a great guild, and thus get his great crafted armor that without FFA looting, he wouldn't have access to.

14th August 2008, 01:56	#82 (permalink)
Voltmeer Newbie Join Date: Apr 2008 Age: 37 Posts: 12 Rep Power: 0	Assuming that items or crafted oriented PvE raiding is just one of many ways to gain money for players. Players in large guilds are going to generally be with other members and out number you and out class you. And, if you do pull off some upset it's probably going to be short lived as you get marked by 500 players. The idea that looting levels the playing ground is at best naive and worst disingenuous. Full looting empowers mobs not indivduals. Plus it frustrates people in general a bad day, a little bordom and getting ganked and losing all their stuff is usually enough of a combination for people to get pissed and uninstall. That's not necessarily a bad thing, but it does squeeze out casual players. The upside of that is it creates strong ties with guilds and that generally makes a very loyal fan base. Open PVP creates gang environment mentality as it is, yu add full looting and it reinforces that further. That's hardly attractive to the vast mjority of casul players.

18th August 2008, 03:30	#98 (permalink)
hotix Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: kapwn Posts: 17 Rep Power: 0	Please make items lootable, if not all items atleast one like old school eq. That I think was the best way to do things, losing 1 item is acceptable especially if things are hard to get, but losing nothing is very lame. That allows people to rez zerg you, and other various noob options.

18th August 2008, 14:36	#99 (permalink)
Abydos Junior Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 96 Rep Power: 1	Whit good system economic, full loot is realy realy great ! __________________ Abydos

18th August 2008, 19:25	#100 (permalink)
Kreeper Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 56 Rep Power: 0	It doesent make sense to have complete lootable bodies because as long as your online and you can get disconnected or something stupid can happen you'll die and than lose all your shit.... Until they have some way to resolve any issue like that I just can't see it benefitting to have that in the game. I mean it all happens to us sometime or another where you just crash, I don't want to lose all my gear because of it.