Summoning Magic

catmorbid · 26th June 2008, 23:53

I would personally like to see proper Summoning Magic implemented, if such is implemented at all (depends actually a lot on the world setting, so not sure about that). This would mean that the summoner actually calls forth (by varying means) a creature from the world. This creature would appear in a means depending on the summoning style, and the summoner would then have to be able to control the being - or convince it to do your bidding otherwise.

The important thing I want to point out that the summoned creatures would not be PETS in the normal mmorpg sense. I.e they wouldn't improve as you improve, they would be like any other same type of creature encountered anywhere else in the world. And yes, you could in fact encounter any of these creatures in the world (getting more to this later).

I would divide summoning magic to the following summoning styles:

Necromancy: The summoner re-animates the dead. He would need an actual dead corpse or a graveyard to allow for this. The quality and type of the undead would correlate to character skill and the quality of the grave. E.g. recently dead turn out to zombies while ancient graves of former heroes could spawn some real bad-ass skeletons. Imagine finding the remains of a dragon

Druidism: The summoners calls forth animals from the wilds and then attempts to control them. There would be some kind of range limitations, meaning you cannot summon a creature that isn't nearby.

Wizardry: You use magic to create elemental creatures out of nowhere. Perhaps an elemental source is needed nearby, or the intensity of such source would increase the strength of the summoning spell. Any form of the element would suffice, e.g. a lit torch would allow summoning fire elementals.

Demonology: By opening portals to other dimensions, the summoner can call forth very powerful creatures, which by default are not necessarily friendly. Summoning the most powerful demons means you need to have the skill to control it, otherwise it can be hostile. You may also need to negotiate or barter with the demon to have it do your bidding - even though you have proper control skills. Demons could vary from the tiny imp to a colossal, horned, fire-breathing... thing of pure malevolence... whatever suits best the style of the world

One actual way to gain the correct summoning spell for a specific entity could in fact be facing the creature and studying it - through magical ways or in combat - or through science, by performing an autopsy. This would make summonings very unique as well, because those who dare explore uncharted areas are more likely to encounter strange new creatures and then summoning them for his aid later.

--more extrapolation--
If creatures had the learning ability (http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/1274-learning-monsters.html#post21355)
summoned creatures could be dealt as individuals, so they could learn, when summoned. Creatures summoned by druids or demonologist would eventually go back to where they came from, if they're still alive, but what if they could keep their gained skills? When summoning a new creature, you would have a chance of summoning a supercreature which has been turned into a real killing machine by other characters. These kinds of creatures could have an affinity for certain player, meaning someone who calls the one creature several times could actually appear more willingly more often. At certain points they could maybe get a "name", to distinguish them from others and the summoner could have the possibility to summon for that specific individual...

OMGPIE · 27th June 2008, 00:00

I like the druidism and necromancy the most but they are all good ideas. Summoning also should require a lot to do. Groups should be required for certain things like for instance...very very powerful demons or if possible gods.

Necromantic · 27th June 2008, 04:08

For Demons and pretty powerful Undead give them the chance to deny the summoner and plain kill him, and yes you know how I vote for summoning and necromancy.

OMGPIE · 27th June 2008, 04:10

Lol like summoning Lichs and demon lords and such they should have to be summoned and then tamed otherwise they just run rampant killing everything they see!

catmorbid · 27th June 2008, 08:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by OMGPIE

I like the druidism and necromancy the most but they are all good ideas. Summoning also should require a lot to do. Groups should be required for certain things like for instance...very very powerful demons or if possible gods.

"Anyone up for Summoning Cthulhu...?"

I like the idea that bigger summons require combined power of several people. This would make guilds have even more importance - or secret cults (back at the Cthulhu). Also, maybe some summons would require human sacrifices, so you'd have to take a bunch of prisoners of war (see this thread, for means on how-to: http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/1...cy-system.html) or have other guild members sacrifice themselves as martyrs.

Sorjak · 27th June 2008, 10:33

How about the more "learned" the summoned creature, the more skill it takes to maintain control of it? It seems natural that a creature that's been summoned many times has had experience with being summoned, which means it knows how much leeway it has.

What about being able to summon angelic beings? or anything besides demons that are still from another plane?

catmorbid · 27th June 2008, 19:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sorjak

How about the more "learned" the summoned creature, the more skill it takes to maintain control of it? It seems natural that a creature that's been summoned many times has had experience with being summoned, which means it knows how much leeway it has.

What about being able to summon angelic beings? or anything besides demons that are still from another plane?

Well, I only see it as natural for more powerful creatures to require a better skill to control them, so of course!

Yes, why not angelic beings as well. They could fall to the same category as demons, hence any planar creature cold be summoned, be it demon or angel or something in between. I can't quite come up with a uniform name, for such summoning style, but maybe something like planecalling?

OMGPIE · 27th June 2008, 21:10

Hehe we could have summoners who can be used as interdemensional (or interplanar) portals? Maybe that could be a group thing? Maybe if there are a bunch of summoners like...a BIG number then maybe they could be used to create a portal that allows a bunch of things from another plane or dimesnion or whatever u wanna call it to bring chaos to a whole region?

catmorbid · 27th June 2008, 22:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by OMGPIE

Hehe we could have summoners who can be used as interdemensional (or interplanar) portals? Maybe that could be a group thing? Maybe if there are a bunch of summoners like...a BIG number then maybe they could be used to create a portal that allows a bunch of things from another plane or dimesnion or whatever u wanna call it to bring chaos to a whole region?

Or... use these dimensions for other purposes, such as gathering resources that simply do not exist in the normal dimension, or even quickly travel between locations, regarding it might be possible that extraordinary dimensions have different laws of physics, time and space. A guild could hide in another dimension and build a portal which allows interdimensional travel. You could easily have your own set of quests in another dimensions as well. This actually reminds me of Oblivion's Oblivion (

). I heard the expansion pack was good, but because plain oblivion sucks ass - or rather it might be playable if I spent 100 hours finding the correct combination of mods to use and still had the energy to actually play the game - I haven't tried it out.

But yeah, this sounds pretty cool. In fact it sounds so cool, a whole new game could be made around this very idea, so I think we've drifted pretty far already... See any land? I didn't think so, either...

OMGPIE · 27th June 2008, 22:58

I have played both of the Oblivion exp pakcs they are cool and all but they are not amazing. It does kind of remind me of Oblivion (the dimesnion place) and how there are certain plants and stuff in there. I like the idea of interrdimensional materials and I think that could be very useful in game.

Camper · 28th June 2008, 03:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by catmorbid

but maybe something like planecalling?

Planebinding, as in Neverwinter Nights.
That allowed you to summon a monster based on your alignment. If you are good, then it's angelic, if evil, then demon.

Sorjak · 28th June 2008, 04:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Camper

Planebinding, as in Neverwinter Nights.
That allowed you to summon a monster based on your alignment. If you are good, then it's angelic, if evil, then demon.

A good aligned person should still be able to summon evil creatures though. What if he needs information, or knowledge of what constitutes a member of the opposite alignment?

Necromantic · 28th June 2008, 10:38

There will be something like the underworld, we heard that, and we brought the idea of going there and gathering souls before. What if for big creatures to summon them you could first travel to whatever world the creature lives and then tame or enslave it by defeating it to later give you better control over it while summoned or only making it summonable in that case at all.
It could give you the opportunity to summon unique, maybe even named creatures.

catmorbid · 28th June 2008, 10:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Camper

Planebinding, as in Neverwinter Nights.
That allowed you to summon a monster based on your alignment. If you are good, then it's angelic, if evil, then demon.

While the name might work, such strict alignment restriction wouldn't. I'd rather have planebinding skill be divided between the types of planes we're talking about, e.g. planebinding, angelic or planebinding, demonic etc.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sorjak

A good aligned person should still be able to summon evil creatures though. What if he needs information, or knowledge of what constitutes a member of the opposite alignment?

Exactly. This is no DnD, your alignment whatsoever will not have DnD style restrictions. Perhaps a good alignment could have a slightly positive influence on the ability to actually control the creature if angelic, and vice versa, but nothing more.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Necromantic

There will be something like the underworld, we heard that, and we brought the idea of going there and gathering souls before. What if for big creatures to summon them you could first travel to whatever world the creature lives and then tame or enslave it by defeating it to later give you better control over it while summoned or only making it summonable in that case at all.
It could give you the opportunity to summon unique, maybe even named creatures.

Although already mentioned to some degree, I agree.

Thalras Naeblis · 4th July 2008, 20:12

I love it all that would be great to see if a demonoligist summons something to strong for him and gets killed by it. I also love where Catmorbid says
"Or... use these dimensions for other purposes, such as gathering resources that simply do not exist in the normal dimension, or even quickly travel between locations, regarding it might be possible that extraordinary dimensions have different laws of physics, time and space."
That would be so cool. Add a whole new aspect to the game.

catmorbid · 5th July 2008, 11:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thalras Naeblis

I love it all that would be great to see if a demonoligist summons something to strong for him and gets killed by it. I also love where Catmorbid says
"Or... use these dimensions for other purposes, such as gathering resources that simply do not exist in the normal dimension, or even quickly travel between locations, regarding it might be possible that extraordinary dimensions have different laws of physics, time and space."
That would be so cool. Add a whole new aspect to the game.

Though, personally I hope the devs ditch all these ideas making it AT LAUNCH, but implement them after we already have a working base with a nice bunch of basic features, that already make for an enjoyable game.

Thalras Naeblis · 6th July 2008, 02:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by catmorbid

Though, personally I hope the devs ditch all these ideas making it AT LAUNCH, but implement them after we already have a working base with a nice bunch of basic features, that already make for an enjoyable game.

Yeah. That could definitely be a nice patch later on for the game. Or maybe even an expansion pack since it should be really large if they add a whole new race in that dimension

Tecknowolf · 7th July 2008, 03:13

Since I just finished reading the Dresden Files series, the idea of having to maintain concentration during summoning or things go bad would be a fun flavor also.

Thalras Naeblis · 7th July 2008, 18:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tecknowolf

Since I just finished reading the Dresden Files series, the idea of having to maintain concentration during summoning or things go bad would be a fun flavor also.

Yeah I would like to see someone concentrating on summoning something powerful and then a guy shoots an arrow through his head

Tecknowolf · 10th July 2008, 03:16

I think this picture best sums up group summoning of an evil nature!
Called Dark Well by J.P. Targete at Epilogue.net
http://www.epilogue.net/cgi/database...ew.pl?id=75081

ServerLatency · 10th July 2008, 03:36

Hmm.. if we can summon large interplanar super beings.. it's only natural we should be able to summon strangers or friends from over vast distances! What happends? Either you have a new partner...or...a sword bludgeoning in your face.
Necromancy? I'm all for ressurecting fire breathing zombie dragons!

catmorbid · 11th July 2008, 06:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tecknowolf

I think this picture best sums up group summoning of an evil nature!
Called Dark Well by J.P. Targete at Epilogue.net
http://www.epilogue.net/cgi/database...ew.pl?id=75081

I wouldn't like to be on their shoes...

lazyasian224 · 26th August 2008, 06:32

i could jsut imagine some cult of summoners gathering around a huge blood rune and summoning some huge demon that just kills everyone and decides to rule the world...

then we find out why.. Mats was controllin it the whole time...

woodoo · 27th August 2008, 10:48

hmmm might it doesnt fit in skill based game.

catmorbid · 27th August 2008, 15:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by woodoo

hmmm might it doesnt fit in skill based game.

Summoning magic in general? Care to elaborate your thoughts?

26th June 2008, 23:53	#1 (permalink)
catmorbid Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Finland Posts: 481 Rep Power: 1	Summoning Magic I would personally like to see proper Summoning Magic implemented, if such is implemented at all (depends actually a lot on the world setting, so not sure about that). This would mean that the summoner actually calls forth (by varying means) a creature from the world. This creature would appear in a means depending on the summoning style, and the summoner would then have to be able to control the being - or convince it to do your bidding otherwise. The important thing I want to point out that the summoned creatures would not be PETS in the normal mmorpg sense. I.e they wouldn't improve as you improve, they would be like any other same type of creature encountered anywhere else in the world. And yes, you could in fact encounter any of these creatures in the world (getting more to this later). I would divide summoning magic to the following summoning styles: Necromancy: The summoner re-animates the dead. He would need an actual dead corpse or a graveyard to allow for this. The quality and type of the undead would correlate to character skill and the quality of the grave. E.g. recently dead turn out to zombies while ancient graves of former heroes could spawn some real bad-ass skeletons. Imagine finding the remains of a dragon Druidism: The summoners calls forth animals from the wilds and then attempts to control them. There would be some kind of range limitations, meaning you cannot summon a creature that isn't nearby. Wizardry: You use magic to create elemental creatures out of nowhere. Perhaps an elemental source is needed nearby, or the intensity of such source would increase the strength of the summoning spell. Any form of the element would suffice, e.g. a lit torch would allow summoning fire elementals. Demonology: By opening portals to other dimensions, the summoner can call forth very powerful creatures, which by default are not necessarily friendly. Summoning the most powerful demons means you need to have the skill to control it, otherwise it can be hostile. You may also need to negotiate or barter with the demon to have it do your bidding - even though you have proper control skills. Demons could vary from the tiny imp to a colossal, horned, fire-breathing... thing of pure malevolence... whatever suits best the style of the world One actual way to gain the correct summoning spell for a specific entity could in fact be facing the creature and studying it - through magical ways or in combat - or through science, by performing an autopsy. This would make summonings very unique as well, because those who dare explore uncharted areas are more likely to encounter strange new creatures and then summoning them for his aid later. --more extrapolation-- If creatures had the learning ability (http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/1274-learning-monsters.html#post21355) summoned creatures could be dealt as individuals, so they could learn, when summoned. Creatures summoned by druids or demonologist would eventually go back to where they came from, if they're still alive, but what if they could keep their gained skills? When summoning a new creature, you would have a chance of summoning a supercreature which has been turned into a real killing machine by other characters. These kinds of creatures could have an affinity for certain player, meaning someone who calls the one creature several times could actually appear more willingly more often. At certain points they could maybe get a "name", to distinguish them from others and the summoner could have the possibility to summon for that specific individual... __________________ Judgement and Perserverance "There's more to the picture, than meets the eye" ESAK: Achiever 33.33%, Explorer 86.67%, Killer 26.67%, Socializer 60.00% Follower of the Great Cat God Felissos Last edited by catmorbid : 26th June 2008 at 23:53. Reason: tweaks

27th June 2008, 00:00	#2 (permalink)
OMGPIE Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Omnipresent Posts: 1,504 Rep Power: 4	I like the druidism and necromancy the most but they are all good ideas. Summoning also should require a lot to do. Groups should be required for certain things like for instance...very very powerful demons or if possible gods. __________________

27th June 2008, 04:08	#3 (permalink)
Necromantic Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: In a basement near you (at least in germany) Posts: 384 Rep Power: 2	For Demons and pretty powerful Undead give them the chance to deny the summoner and plain kill him, and yes you know how I vote for summoning and necromancy. __________________ Assume the end is always the goal. The path to this goal is the way you go. Now think about it, life is the way you go and death is were it ends. So what's wrong with this little devotion to the dead, when it's all humans goal to reach? Aegis Imperium - For I stay to my principles (Explorer 100, Killer 100, Achiever 100, Socializer 100)

27th June 2008, 04:10	#4 (permalink)
OMGPIE Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Omnipresent Posts: 1,504 Rep Power: 4	Lol like summoning Lichs and demon lords and such they should have to be summoned and then tamed otherwise they just run rampant killing everything they see! __________________

27th June 2008, 10:33	#6 (permalink)
Sorjak Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Phoenix, AZ Age: 21 Posts: 425 Rep Power: 1	How about the more "learned" the summoned creature, the more skill it takes to maintain control of it? It seems natural that a creature that's been summoned many times has had experience with being summoned, which means it knows how much leeway it has. What about being able to summon angelic beings? or anything besides demons that are still from another plane? __________________ Achiever 33.33%, Explorer 73.33%, Killer 26.67%, Socializer 66.67%

27th June 2008, 21:10	#8 (permalink)
OMGPIE Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Omnipresent Posts: 1,504 Rep Power: 4	Hehe we could have summoners who can be used as interdemensional (or interplanar) portals? Maybe that could be a group thing? Maybe if there are a bunch of summoners like...a BIG number then maybe they could be used to create a portal that allows a bunch of things from another plane or dimesnion or whatever u wanna call it to bring chaos to a whole region? __________________

27th June 2008, 22:58	#10 (permalink)
OMGPIE Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Omnipresent Posts: 1,504 Rep Power: 4	I have played both of the Oblivion exp pakcs they are cool and all but they are not amazing. It does kind of remind me of Oblivion (the dimesnion place) and how there are certain plants and stuff in there. I like the idea of interrdimensional materials and I think that could be very useful in game. __________________

28th June 2008, 10:38	#13 (permalink)
Necromantic Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: In a basement near you (at least in germany) Posts: 384 Rep Power: 2	There will be something like the underworld, we heard that, and we brought the idea of going there and gathering souls before. What if for big creatures to summon them you could first travel to whatever world the creature lives and then tame or enslave it by defeating it to later give you better control over it while summoned or only making it summonable in that case at all. It could give you the opportunity to summon unique, maybe even named creatures. __________________ Assume the end is always the goal. The path to this goal is the way you go. Now think about it, life is the way you go and death is were it ends. So what's wrong with this little devotion to the dead, when it's all humans goal to reach? Aegis Imperium - For I stay to my principles (Explorer 100, Killer 100, Achiever 100, Socializer 100)

4th July 2008, 20:12	#15 (permalink)
Thalras Naeblis Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: In a dark corner Age: 18 Posts: 124 Rep Power: 1	I love it all that would be great to see if a demonoligist summons something to strong for him and gets killed by it. I also love where Catmorbid says "Or... use these dimensions for other purposes, such as gathering resources that simply do not exist in the normal dimension, or even quickly travel between locations, regarding it might be possible that extraordinary dimensions have different laws of physics, time and space." That would be so cool. Add a whole new aspect to the game. __________________

7th July 2008, 03:13	#18 (permalink)
Tecknowolf Newbie Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 3 Rep Power: 0	Since I just finished reading the Dresden Files series, the idea of having to maintain concentration during summoning or things go bad would be a fun flavor also.

10th July 2008, 03:16	#20 (permalink)
Tecknowolf Newbie Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 3 Rep Power: 0	I think this picture best sums up group summoning of an evil nature! Called Dark Well by J.P. Targete at Epilogue.net http://www.epilogue.net/cgi/database...ew.pl?id=75081

10th July 2008, 03:36	#21 (permalink)
ServerLatency Junior Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 27 Rep Power: 1	Hmm.. if we can summon large interplanar super beings.. it's only natural we should be able to summon strangers or friends from over vast distances! What happends? Either you have a new partner...or...a sword bludgeoning in your face. Necromancy? I'm all for ressurecting fire breathing zombie dragons!

26th August 2008, 06:32	#23 (permalink)
lazyasian224 Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 72 Rep Power: 1	i could jsut imagine some cult of summoners gathering around a huge blood rune and summoning some huge demon that just kills everyone and decides to rule the world... then we find out why.. Mats was controllin it the whole time...

27th August 2008, 10:48	#24 (permalink)
woodoo Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 56 Rep Power: 0	hmmm might it doesnt fit in skill based game.