Night Vs. Day

[niblick]

I kinda like this.
Sit about in moonlight near a path waiting for someone with a torch (great big neon target) to wander down the road into my ambush.

[Eldrek]

Solution to gamma uppers: light sources affect your fov fog.. You know the standard 'fog' that appears at the end of your field of view? The game could have a set fov distance at night that increases when you carry a light source.

[Prototype]

I think that in the night it should be dark and you would see nothing whitout a source of light the same in caves

Originally Posted by niblick

I kinda like this.
Sit about in moonlight near a path waiting for someone with a torch (great big neon target) to wander down the road into my ambush.

sounds cool to me

[Manorothh]

I love the idea of a dark night. It would be very inmersive and will add several posibilities, like the torch or lamps, spells to increase vision or maybe, playable races wich could see in the dark, like Drows.
I think the idea adds a lot of possibilities in the mmoRpg play.

[Phratello]

Would adjusting your monitor settings actually work? For instance my monitor brightness is currently at 90 and bringing it up to 100 does nothing to make it any better. Only way to "cheat the system" is thought an in game gamma slider and that can be limited depending on time of day in the game.

[Xyphon]

I love this idea, and wish it was still being implemented in modern MMOs.

It's the time of night when it should be pitch black out, yet people are running around, socializing, killing monsters, and crafting in the middle of the wilderness with no light sources for miles! Why doesn't it FEEL like that?

I guess the problem here is dynamic lighting and how resource intensive it would be. I'm not entirely sure how easy/difficult it would be to add this, but if Mortal Online wants to be successful... they do have to allow older machines to run it at an adequate FPS average. However, I think this is a great idea... making day and night actually change the way you think, instead of rarely noticing if it's supposed to be day time or night time, as happened to me countless times in World of Warcraft and every other MMO I've played since Everquest.

Don't make night time impossible to see in... just make it different from day time!

[EDIT] Plus, some casters could have a spell that envelops them in light, so that they have an aura of light around them, lighting up their surroundings. Might add some variation as opposed to everyone carrying torches (which yes, that's all everyone did in the medieval ages... but we also couldn't cast spells or bring ourselves back to life back then either!).

[Lachrymose]

Originally Posted by Xyphon

I guess the problem here is dynamic lighting and how resource intensive it would be. I'm not entirely sure how easy/difficult it would be to add this, but if Mortal Online wants to be successful... they do have to allow older machines to run it at an adequate FPS average.

it wouldn't be difficult to add this and it wouldn't be very resource intensive. they'd basically just have to keep track of the time of day, and scale the light intensity, ambience, etc. accordingly.

if i don't see a substantial different b/w night and day, i'll be a little disappointed. such a small thing would add a whole lot imo.

[Xyphon]

Originally Posted by Lachrymose

it wouldn't be difficult to add this and it wouldn't be very resource intensive. they'd basically just have to keep track of the time of day, and scale the light intensity, ambience, etc. accordingly.

if i don't see a substantial different b/w night and day, i'll be a little disappointed. such a small thing would add a whole lot imo.

Ah, that makes sense. Just have it show different settings based on the time of day... I guess I wasn't thinking about it enough.

And, after thinking about this idea for a while... I would love to have day and night be visibly different AND affect gameplay. It would change the strategy so much, just like in real war. Night time skirmishes would be interesting, since you never know what lies around the corner (or heck, even right next to you!) when it's dark out!

[dawnofdeath]

Yeah sounds cool, if you can buy a latern/tourch. I mean have you ever tried to walk in the forest during night irl? :P not like there are street lights.
Also I would really like to see some variation of weather in this game. So tiring that it's always the same weather in the same areas/zones. Make it rain/cloudy/sunny once in awhile etc even storms would be cool (but of course it shouldnt occur that often)

[Stump]

Originally Posted by dawnofdeath

Yeah sounds cool, if you can buy a latern/tourch. I mean have you ever tried to walk in the forest during night irl? :P not like there are street lights.
Also I would really like to see some variation of weather in this game. So tiring that it's always the same weather in the same areas/zones. Make it rain/cloudy/sunny once in awhile etc even storms would be cool (but of course it shouldnt occur that often)

Yeah, if the night is cloud, then you see almost nothing, but if there is a moon and stars, then I could go in a forest without some source of light.

[Milarepa]

Having it influence skills and magic would be great. Stealth is an obvious exemple, instead of some unrealistic 100% stealth, have stealth fade your character display by a certain amount depending on skill level, and it would naturally work much better in the dark.

Then some magic could be day/night dependant, would love to see more situation dependant magic. Like fire spells you need to be near a source of fire to cast, elemental spells where you need a body of water nearby, sun powered magic, night magic etc. Would add a lot of strategic depth by having to know your opponent and the terrain around. Don't engage a water elementalist near a river or a storm priest when there are dark clouds in the sky

[Ulti]

Couldn't the sun be made the only Lightsource? You can then use dynamic shadows on all objekts like trees, walls etc.
even clouds so you could watch the shadow of clouds run across the lands. And as the sun sets down you can see the darkness of the night advance slowly into the land from the opposite side.

[Rathius]

Originally Posted by Ulti

Couldn't the sun be made the only Lightsource? You can then use dynamic shadows on all objekts like trees, walls etc.
even clouds so you could watch the shadow of clouds run across the lands. And as the sun sets down you can see the darkness of the night advance slowly into the land from the opposite side.

Yes... but to get the proper light density, other than a single depth of shadow across all objects, it requires a good portion of processing. With a single light source you then have to fake the radiosity and refraction of light with... more lights.
Here's an example of what you would see with a single light source with different processing:

As you can see the direct illumination looks rather flat, while the radiosity looks more believable. If you look closely at the edges and corners in the radiosity portion you can see the of shadow opacity changing.

[Ulti]

Originally Posted by Rathius

difference like day and night!

[Milarepa]

I know Oblivion is a single payer game (a "take a walk in the forest" simulator imho) and MMo\s are totally different beasts in terms of the stress the many players on screen can put on the engine, but the illumination system worked great in that game.

[M-Demon]

I actually got very involved discussing a real night cycle with my friend.

I don't think it would work as well from any other perspective, but using 1st person would make real nights a very interesting concept in an MMORPG setting.

With a huge world featuring trees, rocks, buildings, and terrain - combined with 1st person - this would make a world where you could literally hide from other players. Not stealth. Hide. As in actually sneak up on someone while they are doing something.

If you made the night dark, as it should be, than most players would bring a torch or some form of light to see the task they are doing. Say a miner is out mining ore or lumberjacker is cutting down trees. They would be focused on their skill, most likely with a light. This makes them prime targets for someone sneaking around in the dark waiting to PK some poor innocent victim.

Add to the fact you have skills that I'm sure are going to enhance sneaking, you could have some very amazing scenarios happen with a 1st person MMO featuring a night cycle. Just think about it.

[Gungrave]

Originally Posted by Milarepa

I know Oblivion is a single payer game (a "take a walk in the forest" simulator imho) and MMo\s are totally different beasts in terms of the stress the many players on screen can put on the engine, but the illumination system worked great in that game.

Yeah, nights are pretty dark in Oblivion (and beautiful ), and in caves or dungeons you are virtually blind without torch, glowing staff etc. But Night Eye/Light spells >>. I would like to see such things in MO, dark nights can have great tactical impact on the PvP. Shoot the torches, etc

[Rodoe]

All of this sounds really cool. I can imagine before night falls, the tension, and all the frightening creatures that hunts at night rise and howl. That could be really exciting, making it actually scary to be out at night. And a great opportunity to make an ambush on travellers.

Make it happen!

[mudface]

like in elder scrolls u could add things to your items like the light and stuff and so on also. man talking about elder scrolls i just started playing morrwind agin speak of the devil. and the way there talking about this game really reminds me of elder scrolls in so many ways first person and full out action combat.iv all ways though they should make a mmo like that and they or in this game i love it

[mudface]

i was just re watching the video becuase this night thing came up in irc channel. and its really dark when there in the cave in the trailer cheeck it out

[Rodoe]

Especially in caves there should be total darkness, I mean that's reality pretty much. The further down you go the darker it gets. Using a torch in caves or in the forest would be truly amazing.

[dawnofdeath]

Agreed not only does it give more of an advantage to remain unseen in the darkness but also the fear factor! Imagine walking in a pitch black forest not knowing if there is an ambush or some beasts lurking about. Same in the caves, you walk into the darkness and get attacked by a zombie or something from nowhere ^^

[Archaaz]

I think day/night cycles are a wonderful idea, especially if the night is truly dark and some form of illumination is required to navigate. The picture painted in this thread is amazing. If there are moon phases, this could influence the amount of light as well.

I also like the fact that features such as this (and others such as temperature, weather, etc), coupled with a limited carrying capacity, could lead to an adventurer or group of adventurers carefully choosing their equipment before venturing out. Just like in the old PnP days, each character would choose a tinderbox, torches, and the like, before exploring a dungeon. This could lead to questions during the dungeon crawl; should a torch or two be sacrificed to make way for that extra bit of gold, or will it likely prove crucial later?

The need to camp for the evening, or attempt to make it to a city by nightfall, would become much more vital. How about a town or tower surrounded by a forest; a bit eerie by day, but at night filled with undead.

I love the idea of featuring certain creatures who are active only at night, and perhaps even have an aversion to light. Total or near darkness could also provide for unique dungeons, each with its own atmosphere. Perhaps one dungeon is completely dark, another perpetually lit by torches on the walls, and still another illuminated by some glowing mineral or fungus, etc.

And who can forget Dragonlance's Raistlin and his Staff of Magius? One murmur of the word "Shirak!" and all is illuminated in a pale blue light.

[Rodoe]

Originally Posted by dawnofdeath

Agreed not only does it give more of an advantage to remain unseen in the darkness but also the fear factor! Imagine walking in a pitch black forest not knowing if there is an ambush or some beasts lurking about. Same in the caves, you walk into the darkness and get attacked by a zombie or something from nowhere ^^

I'd scream like a girl if something confronted me in the dark, just to spice things up.

[dawnofdeath]

Originally Posted by Rodoe

I'd scream like a girl if something confronted me in the dark, just to spice things up.

lol I'd get pretty jumpy too I reckon x) don't supprise me in the dark or I might chop your head off as a reflex lol

[BlackOrc]

I think: Two day cycles in one day real life time. Looks like:

6 a.m. - 12 p.m. - 6 p.m. - 12 a.m.

day ---- night --- day ---- night

[OMGPIE]

Night should be bright enough but not bright enough to see really clearly. The moon is pretty bright when you have clean air trust me you don't need a torch if you are out and there is no trees or anything above you say in a field. Torches should help immensely and should cause you to be seen way farther and clearer.

[Neek]

Torches are a double-edged sword. They allow you to see farther, but they alert other players to your presence. You simply have to weigh the risk/reward when you go out alone.