businesses

niblick · 22nd August 2008, 20:34

This would be too much effort for launch but as a future feature from an expansion I think it would be cool to be able to start up and own a business.

Basically I propose setting up "business" guilds which you can start and join as many as you want while staying in your guild. Ths business would have shares to be distributed among founders/employees and a system of splitting profits among the stock holders be implimented through the mail system.

The business system would allow players who are highly skilled crafters to team up with scavangers and operate as a unit outwith the guild.

Great crafters could offer shares in a venture to craft elite armor (in order to get coin for resources) and a wealthy knight would be able to invest and reap the profits. The best crafters in the world could also go into business together and monopolise pots or armor or what not.

I think this would be amazing at extending the basic economies of mmorpg's and introduce a new system for economic dominance.
Having people teaming up to create the same item, retail the item, and split the profits could help reduce the amount of players undercutting each other and avoid deflation.

Lachrymose · 22nd August 2008, 21:18

don't forget about advertising.

i think this is a pretty cool idea. i spent a lot of time in WoW just at the AH just playing the market. the only problem is, it seems maybe a little more like a wall street simulator.. i'm not sure it would fit very well into a medieval fantasy style setting.

but, i wouldn't care if it seems a little out of place, i like the idea. i'd be all for it.

Hereshk · 22nd August 2008, 21:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lachrymose

don't forget about advertising.

i would start the buiseness who build the panel and get paid to puts some ads on it :P

eheh, j/k

seriously, it would be a good thing to have buisenesses... though I wonder how it would be to run a buiseness in a full pvp environment ...

"its my market... surrender ur fresh breads to me or I'll crush you"

then again this competition could bring very funny situations, mheheh >=D

niblick · 23rd August 2008, 01:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lachrymose

it seems maybe a little more like a wall street simulator.. i'm not sure it would fit very well into a medieval fantasy style setting.

I can't argue that it isn't a wallstreet sim, because it pretty much is.

As for wallstreet in a fantasy sim. There were futures being traded in ancient venice. Fair enough that isn't as far back as the fantasy setting MO is aiming at but I feel it could work as long as shares were traded as items rather than a "stock market" with the focus on business models rather than trading in shares and what not.

Strange idea for a fantasy mmo but it could be amazing.

Lachrymose · 23rd August 2008, 03:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by niblick

I can't argue that it isn't a wallstreet sim, because it pretty much is.

As for wallstreet in a fantasy sim. There were futures being traded in ancient venice. Fair enough that isn't as far back as the fantasy setting MO is aiming at but I feel it could work as long as shares were traded as items rather than a "stock market" with the focus on business models rather than trading in shares and what not.

Strange idea for a fantasy mmo but it could be amazing.

yea, i could see it working if you were actually in possession of the item, but as i mentioned in another thread, what exactly are you going to do with all those items? i guess you could store them all in your bank or a house, but it would probably be a pain.

i think businesses would be great though, and again stocks/commodities would be fun too, although i wouldn't bee too disappointed (or surprised) if i didn't see them in the game.

Cadavre · 17th September 2008, 22:05

I think the last thing this game needs is a way for players to set up a monopoly on one particular item.

Why would you limit investing in a business to just the rich people. Everyone should be able to buy shares of a business and profit from it. I like the idea of just having player run shops and not full fledged businesses. It will just end up undercutting the casual gamers who will make up a significant part of the population.

Lachrymose · 17th September 2008, 22:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cadavre

I think the last thing this game needs is a way for players to set up a monopoly on one particular item.

Why would you limit investing in a business to just the rich people. Everyone should be able to buy shares of a business and profit from it. I like the idea of just having player run shops and not full fledged businesses. It will just end up undercutting the casual gamers who will make up a significant part of the population.

no one ever said investing would be limited to the rich. why wouldn't everyone be able to invest?

also, you wouldn't have to worry about monopolies on items. since there is no diversity among items (people don't actually create things, they simply recreate what the devs allow them to), there would be little reason to choose one person's product over another's. not to mention that local economies would allow sellers to pack up and move to another city if the competition in one city is too fierce.

casual gamers wouldn't be "undercut"... if anything, it could be pretty beneficial for them.. you can invest in a business, and be making money while you aren't even playing. since casual gamers may not have as much time to play, they could be making just as much money through investing as someone else is while through playing.

osteo · 18th September 2008, 00:12

This idea could be very cool. Because sometimes in past games some of my problems were just getting the product out. Yes i had my one little shop, but With this tier system you came up with a person could just harvest, or create something then go to a public place to try and find someone that could sell for him. The only thing i wounder is that the creator would get paid even less. Maybe there could be a way to create small contracts of some sort.

Also if you did find someone to sell for you automatically got free advertising. Correct me if I'm wrong but I think your name gets put on anything you make in this game. Therefore, they could send you in game mail to make personal orders if they felt like it.

OMGPIE · 22nd September 2008, 04:09

How about unofficial businesses? I don't want advertisement signs everywhere saying EAT AT JOE'S WE GOT LOTS O FISH!! It will ruin the cities so much.

eka · 22nd September 2008, 19:49

i think this is a brilliant idea

osteo · 30th November 2008, 08:57

@OMGPIE i wasnt talking about signs i was talking about when you make an item it could present the name of the maker thats all lol. It would suck to see all those signs though LOL you crack me up omgpie.

Azureal · 30th November 2008, 10:06

I would hope that the ability to place a building/structure, rent/own vendors and sell my wares from that building is a "feature" that is available from the start.

Parad1ne · 30th November 2008, 15:38

Yeah I think it would be cool to be able to choose whether you want a house style building or a store type building. Of course it wouldn't really be a big business, but it would definatley feel that way since you have your own store.

I also don't see how this could be a full time thing. Running a business would take up almost all of your playing time, and I can't imagine how people would split the money and actually make a profit off of it.

It just wouldn't work because you wont get a good stream of customers, and you wont make a profit if you split the money.

Azureal · 2nd December 2008, 07:49

I think a lot of the concern people are feeling about players setting up businesses/shops/whatever in game stems from never having played a game that allowed this. I blame the current crop of available MMOs on the market. Housing? Player run vendors? Player driven economy? Viable crafting systems? This is all stuff thats routinely ignored by development companies intent on making the most amount of money in the quickest amount of time (lots of boxes sold + lots of subs after the first 30 days). Do I blame them? Not really, but someone has to break the mold, go out on a limb and try something different. Theres a lot of gamers my age out there (in their 30s now) that broke their teeth on UO, and are either still playing that game (I dont blame them, its still good stuff) or have given up hope of finding an MMO that challenges them.

A player setting up a shop ingame that sells broadswords (for example only) isnt a bad thing, its a good thing, for reasons such as:

1. When you need a new sword, you know where to get one from. A good shopkeeper will keep a good stock of items at all times.

2. It promotes healthy competition among other crafters. If Bob next door is making and selling broadswords for 50 gold, Fred next door will try and do better, for less. Win/Win for the customer.

If and when MO releases, my sole intent will be to (hopefully) buy/build/place a modest size home. In my home I will (hopefully) place vendors. Those vendors will (hopefully) stock the full range of products I can make. Its my intent to build my reputation, through my craft, so that players will know if they need a (insert my crafted goods here) they will find it at my shop.

Elfvis · 2nd December 2008, 15:51

If you have your own store, I am thinking something like Neopets will occur. I think it is a very interesting idea in an MMO where our characters act as the crafter we hire NPC's to work in a store to sell our crafts at a set price while we are off in the world adventuring. The higher our crafting the more pricey our stuff gets the more chance of getting robbed maybe I have more money so I hire guards to watch the store : P.

If you think about it, it gives very unquie solo player experience in that your store kinda becomes your strong hold in a way and displays your power as a character. You go to a mall, when you pass that Gucci store with the 2 armed guards in/outside you kinda know that Gucci must be a rich/badass : P

I like to concept.

Still in a 100% populated world how much space is allowed for player stores, or are player store/hired NPC the ONLY stores? Making spaces competitive would be interesting indeed, can you set up shop anywhere? I image anyone could get a hut hire someone, but they would be less guarded against attacks. Cities run buy guilds could also sell store front to other none guild or alliance members etc.

ilocpis23 · 2nd December 2008, 22:05

What about mafia? Is that a business?

Resin · 3rd December 2008, 00:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Azureal

I think a lot of the concern people are feeling about players setting up businesses/shops/whatever in game stems from never having played a game that allowed this. I blame the current crop of available MMOs on the market. Housing? Player run vendors? Player driven economy? Viable crafting systems? This is all stuff thats routinely ignored by development companies intent on making the most amount of money in the quickest amount of time (lots of boxes sold + lots of subs after the first 30 days). Do I blame them? Not really, but someone has to break the mold, go out on a limb and try something different. Theres a lot of gamers my age out there (in their 30s now) that broke their teeth on UO, and are either still playing that game (I dont blame them, its still good stuff) or have given up hope of finding an MMO that challenges them.

A player setting up a shop ingame that sells broadswords (for example only) isnt a bad thing, its a good thing, for reasons such as:

1. When you need a new sword, you know where to get one from. A good shopkeeper will keep a good stock of items at all times.

2. It promotes healthy competition among other crafters. If Bob next door is making and selling broadswords for 50 gold, Fred next door will try and do better, for less. Win/Win for the customer.

If and when MO releases, my sole intent will be to (hopefully) buy/build/place a modest size home. In my home I will (hopefully) place vendors. Those vendors will (hopefully) stock the full range of products I can make. Its my intent to build my reputation, through my craft, so that players will know if they need a (insert my crafted goods here) they will find it at my shop.

+1 for competitive store fronts.

edit: regarding investing in buisnesses, I made a thread about guild bonds and notaries that I think would pertain. The key component would be the making official of player created documents.

adrala · 3rd December 2008, 13:12

There are great range good ideas for businesses run by players in a sandbox game.
I look into the creation of mail system ran by players.I think such a bussines would be vital for players and economy.
In order for this to work there should be no global anything nor instant travel. So i keep my fingers crossed

Aftrmath0 · 3rd December 2008, 17:41

Businesses are a great way to build a repor with the community. If people understand and use your business you can utilize that out in the PVP world ... protection and trust! thats what you need in a Sandbox world.

22nd August 2008, 20:34	#1 (permalink)
niblick Newbie Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 40 Rep Power: 1	businesses This would be too much effort for launch but as a future feature from an expansion I think it would be cool to be able to start up and own a business. Basically I propose setting up "business" guilds which you can start and join as many as you want while staying in your guild. Ths business would have shares to be distributed among founders/employees and a system of splitting profits among the stock holders be implimented through the mail system. The business system would allow players who are highly skilled crafters to team up with scavangers and operate as a unit outwith the guild. Great crafters could offer shares in a venture to craft elite armor (in order to get coin for resources) and a wealthy knight would be able to invest and reap the profits. The best crafters in the world could also go into business together and monopolise pots or armor or what not. I think this would be amazing at extending the basic economies of mmorpg's and introduce a new system for economic dominance. Having people teaming up to create the same item, retail the item, and split the profits could help reduce the amount of players undercutting each other and avoid deflation.

22nd August 2008, 21:18	#2 (permalink)
Lachrymose Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: SC, United States Clan: Aegis Imperium Playstyle: PK/PvP Age: 22 Posts: 1,764 Rep Power: 5	don't forget about advertising. i think this is a pretty cool idea. i spent a lot of time in WoW just at the AH just playing the market. the only problem is, it seems maybe a little more like a wall street simulator.. i'm not sure it would fit very well into a medieval fantasy style setting. but, i wouldn't care if it seems a little out of place, i like the idea. i'd be all for it. __________________ /thread ________________________________________________ Killer 100.00%, Achiever 46.67%, Explorer 46.67%, Socializer 6.67%

22nd September 2008, 04:09	#9 (permalink)
OMGPIE Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Omnipresent Posts: 1,504 Rep Power: 4	How about unofficial businesses? I don't want advertisement signs everywhere saying EAT AT JOE'S WE GOT LOTS O FISH!! It will ruin the cities so much. __________________

30th November 2008, 15:38	#13 (permalink)
Parad1ne Junior Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 108 Rep Power: 0	Yeah I think it would be cool to be able to choose whether you want a house style building or a store type building. Of course it wouldn't really be a big business, but it would definatley feel that way since you have your own store. I also don't see how this could be a full time thing. Running a business would take up almost all of your playing time, and I can't imagine how people would split the money and actually make a profit off of it. It just wouldn't work because you wont get a good stream of customers, and you wont make a profit if you split the money. __________________ "Death is only the beginning"

2nd December 2008, 15:51	#15 (permalink)
Elfvis Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Clearwater, Florida Posts: 260 Rep Power: 1	If you have your own store, I am thinking something like Neopets will occur. I think it is a very interesting idea in an MMO where our characters act as the crafter we hire NPC's to work in a store to sell our crafts at a set price while we are off in the world adventuring. The higher our crafting the more pricey our stuff gets the more chance of getting robbed maybe I have more money so I hire guards to watch the store : P. If you think about it, it gives very unquie solo player experience in that your store kinda becomes your strong hold in a way and displays your power as a character. You go to a mall, when you pass that Gucci store with the 2 armed guards in/outside you kinda know that Gucci must be a rich/badass : P I like to concept. Still in a 100% populated world how much space is allowed for player stores, or are player store/hired NPC the ONLY stores? Making spaces competitive would be interesting indeed, can you set up shop anywhere? I image anyone could get a hut hire someone, but they would be less guarded against attacks. Cities run buy guilds could also sell store front to other none guild or alliance members etc. Last edited by Elfvis : 2nd December 2008 at 15:55.

17th September 2008, 22:05	#6 (permalink)
Cadavre Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 16 Rep Power: 1	I think the last thing this game needs is a way for players to set up a monopoly on one particular item. Why would you limit investing in a business to just the rich people. Everyone should be able to buy shares of a business and profit from it. I like the idea of just having player run shops and not full fledged businesses. It will just end up undercutting the casual gamers who will make up a significant part of the population.

18th September 2008, 00:12	#8 (permalink)
osteo Junior Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 114 Rep Power: 0	This idea could be very cool. Because sometimes in past games some of my problems were just getting the product out. Yes i had my one little shop, but With this tier system you came up with a person could just harvest, or create something then go to a public place to try and find someone that could sell for him. The only thing i wounder is that the creator would get paid even less. Maybe there could be a way to create small contracts of some sort. Also if you did find someone to sell for you automatically got free advertising. Correct me if I'm wrong but I think your name gets put on anything you make in this game. Therefore, they could send you in game mail to make personal orders if they felt like it.

22nd September 2008, 19:49	#10 (permalink)
eka Newbie Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 1 Rep Power: 0	i think this is a brilliant idea

30th November 2008, 08:57	#11 (permalink)
osteo Junior Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 114 Rep Power: 0	@OMGPIE i wasnt talking about signs i was talking about when you make an item it could present the name of the maker thats all lol. It would suck to see all those signs though LOL you crack me up omgpie.

30th November 2008, 10:06	#12 (permalink)
Azureal Newbie Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Perth, Australia Age: 31 Posts: 5 Rep Power: 0	I would hope that the ability to place a building/structure, rent/own vendors and sell my wares from that building is a "feature" that is available from the start.

2nd December 2008, 07:49	#14 (permalink)
Azureal Newbie Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Perth, Australia Age: 31 Posts: 5 Rep Power: 0	I think a lot of the concern people are feeling about players setting up businesses/shops/whatever in game stems from never having played a game that allowed this. I blame the current crop of available MMOs on the market. Housing? Player run vendors? Player driven economy? Viable crafting systems? This is all stuff thats routinely ignored by development companies intent on making the most amount of money in the quickest amount of time (lots of boxes sold + lots of subs after the first 30 days). Do I blame them? Not really, but someone has to break the mold, go out on a limb and try something different. Theres a lot of gamers my age out there (in their 30s now) that broke their teeth on UO, and are either still playing that game (I dont blame them, its still good stuff) or have given up hope of finding an MMO that challenges them. A player setting up a shop ingame that sells broadswords (for example only) isnt a bad thing, its a good thing, for reasons such as: 1. When you need a new sword, you know where to get one from. A good shopkeeper will keep a good stock of items at all times. 2. It promotes healthy competition among other crafters. If Bob next door is making and selling broadswords for 50 gold, Fred next door will try and do better, for less. Win/Win for the customer. If and when MO releases, my sole intent will be to (hopefully) buy/build/place a modest size home. In my home I will (hopefully) place vendors. Those vendors will (hopefully) stock the full range of products I can make. Its my intent to build my reputation, through my craft, so that players will know if they need a (insert my crafted goods here) they will find it at my shop.

2nd December 2008, 22:05	#16 (permalink)
ilocpis23 Newbie Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 38 Rep Power: 1	What about mafia? Is that a business?

3rd December 2008, 13:12	#18 (permalink)
adrala Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Spain Posts: 259 Rep Power: 1	There are great range good ideas for businesses run by players in a sandbox game. I look into the creation of mail system ran by players.I think such a bussines would be vital for players and economy. In order for this to work there should be no global anything nor instant travel. So i keep my fingers crossed __________________ adrala's list of people to sadomize and kill on sight 1. the little pinky angel Oophus

3rd December 2008, 17:41	#19 (permalink)
Aftrmath0 Newbie Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 30 Rep Power: 1	Businesses are a great way to build a repor with the community. If people understand and use your business you can utilize that out in the PVP world ... protection and trust! thats what you need in a Sandbox world. __________________ "Success is our only option, but fear is the only doorway to Success."